#KnowYourNeighbor: In Talks With Chintan Girish Modi
Chintan Girish Modi is a freelance writer, educator, researcher, teacher trainer and copy editor living in Mumbai. He is the founder of Friendships Across Borders: Aao Dosti Karein, an initiative to promote friendship between Indians and Pakistanis. In a candid interview with LHP, Chintan talks about his visits to Pakistan, the commonalities that the both countries share and how citizens from both sides can promote peace across the border.
Do tell us something about yourself for the benefit of our audience.
I enjoy poetry, going for walks, and watching sitcoms. I write, edit and teach for a living. I am 31, single and ready to mingle. I live in Mumbai, but go weak in the knees at the mention of trees, hills, and rivers. And, well, I love working on projects that involve cross-cultural friendships, dialogue and collaboration. I hope that answers your question. I guess you were looking for a LinkedIn meets OkCupid profile.
Do you think we (Pakistanis and Indians) are still connected through our lifestyle and love for food? Tell us something about your experiences.
Food is certainly an important source of connection between people because it is associated with joy, celebration, festivals, stories, and cultural traditions. They can go on for hours talking about favorite recipes, places to eat, and memories of special occasions. However, food preferences can also vary greatly, and religion often plays a role here. I like to believe that most people try to be respectful, and they are sensitive enough to figure out what is a no-go area for someone else. I am not sure what you mean by lifestyle but I would say a confident 'Yes' if you are talking about being surrounded by relatives, watching Bollywood films, and having inept politicians to complain about.
In your opinion, how can India and Pakistan benefit from each other?
I think there is a lot of potential in enabling collaboration between Indian and Pakistani educators -- teachers at school, college and university levels, also curriculum creators, textbook writers, and publishers of books for children. Young people inherit many of their prejudices from adults, and that's a terrible legacy to leave behind. Imagine putting together a poetry book for high school students, with selections from the work of Lal Ded, Faiz Ahmed Faiz, Kamala Das, Arundhathi Subramaniam, Sara Shagufta, Mirabai, Shah Abdul Latif Bhitai, Bulleh Shah, Tenzin Tsundue, Tukaram, and Vikram Seth. These are just a few examples. I recognize that English comes with its colonial baggage, and translations can sometimes do a poor job of matching up to the original. However, I see merit in introducing students to a wider literary universe that they can learn from and appreciate as theirs, in a way that transgresses the idea of impermeable boundaries. I would love to see history educators from both countries work together but that can be a really tough one if you do not have the right people on board. I mean people who are unafraid to go beyond the sanctioned state narrative, or even their own nationalistic blinkers. It might be safer and more productive to get educators to begin working together to design student exchanges focused on popular culture, sharing of local stories, art and photography projects, or innovations geared towards solving civic issues. One need not frame such exchanges as conflict resolution exercises. That can make participants overly conscious, reticent or superficial. It might be better to have them find common ground in a more organic way through the process of working together. Human connections happen on their own; too much facilitation can ruin things.
How do you think your trip to Pakistan has helped you break stereotypes?
I have been to Pakistan four times, and each experience has taught me something new. I think my biggest learning has had to do with encountering the diversity in that country. On my first visit, I expected to see a lot of women wearing burqas. I didn't. And my conclusion was that many Muslim women in India wear burqas because, as minorities, they feel they need to assert their unique cultural identity. And I guessed that Muslim women in Pakistan didn't need to do that because they were not minorities. What a stupid, hasty inference! Besides, it was based on the experience of only one city -- Lahore. I had zero understanding of what it meant to be a Hazara or an Ahmedi living in Pakistan. Also, we were on a five-day itinerary that took us mainly to places that would be accessible only to the fairly rich. On a subsequent trip to Lahore, two female friends and I were in the Andhroon Shehr area, walking through a bazaar. Out of the blue, a stranger interrupted one of my friends, and asked her to cover her head with a dupatta. That seemed a lot like India, where many men feel entitled to telling women how they should dress in public. That incident shattered the image that many of my other Pakistani friends were trying to project -- that of a country that offers the highest respect to all women. I realize that there is a need to speak up against negative media portrayals but covering up your flaws is a disservice to your own people. All our countries and communities have tangled webs of problems to sort out, and we can do that only when we get out of the me-better-than-you-game. I would also like to say that most of my interactions in Pakistan have been with people in big cities who primarily speak English, other than fruit vendors, tea sellers, cab drivers, and waiters. I know hardly any Hindus, Christians or Parsis there. There's a bigger Pakistan out there, which speaks multiple languages, and has diverse histories and aspirations. Pakistan is not just Mohsin Hamid, Kamila Shamsie, Sharmeen Obaid Chinoy, Mohammed Hanif and Malala Yousafzai -- names we read in the New York Times.
What are some of the commonalities that both India and Pakistan share?
A whole lot! Both spend too much money on defence, and too little on social justice and education. Both have been held hostage by their past. They are like those exes who can't see each other happy. Hmm. The other commonalities we share, and should celebrate, are largely related to language and culture. And they aren't a surprise! The history of India and Pakistan as separate countries is quite recent.
What have your experiences taught you about the other country?
I have learnt that people in Pakistan hold a variety of views on political and religious matters. Some curse the United States but would love to get a green card. Some think of every terror attack in Pakistan as a conspiracy by either India, Israel, or the US. Some hate it when it is assumed that being Pakistani automatically implies being religious. Some are glad that the Partition happened because their Muslim identity would have been threatened in a country with a majority of Hindus; others hate the fact that they live in a country where mullahs have so much power. Pakistanis do not have a homogeneous experience of being Pakistani. Their gender, class, caste, religion, sect, occupation, and closeness to the military or elected officials has a bearing on the amount of freedom they enjoy. That must sound a lot like India, and many other parts of the world.
How can we, as citizens, initiate friendly relations between the two countries?
By not buying into hate propaganda sold by people within one's family, news media, politicians, religious leaders, textbooks, think tanks, and whoever else! Bombing each other is not an option. Too many people have lost too much. It's time to stop wearing wounds as badges of honor, or as reminders of retribution. Let's begin healing. Thinking of each other as enemies will not take us forward. Let's connect using social media, for starters. That doesn't even require visas. There are many interesting projects, such as yours, that want to help Indians and Pakistanis get to know each other. I'm sure that these will grow in number.
In your opinion, how is social media playing a role in bridging the gap between the two countries?
Facebook, Twitter, Instagram and other social media platforms give Indians and Pakistanis an opportunity to have casual, stress-free conversations on numerous topics. They can share their personal lives, and develop close emotional ties. Some end up meeting each other if they are lucky enough to get visas, or they send gifts for each other with visiting friends and relatives. Of course, there's a flip side. There are Indians and Pakistanis who use social media to abuse each other, or each other's countries.
Your message to war mongers?
I trust that you will someday recognize that, in war, we are all losers. Let us stop inflicting pain on each other. I am sure that you are convinced of your position, and might have reasons for it. You may have lost a loved one in a war or terror attack. Your family may have faced severe hardships during the Partition. I don't know. There could be so many reasons. But nurturing enmity and baying for the enemy's blood isn't going to secure our peace.